Wow, just amazing. I never read this before, but it felt like it was a Casefile. Very fast paced. It didn't feel like the digest that I've been used to.
I personally love the Digests and I think there are lots of great, enjoyable Hardy Boys stories- including some that may approach the level of action in the Casefiles books. But the reason The Crisscross Crime might feel so much like one of the Casefiles is because it apparently was originally intended to be one of them, but when the series got cancelled, it was converted into one of the Digests instead.
Yeah, had the Casefiles not been cancelled, "The Crisscross Crime" would've been #130 and released around July 1998.
So was that the whole book, or was there stuff that was left out?
This book was really good. I didn't know it was originally a Casefiles book.
Quote from: Katie on February 06, 2017, 09:48:52 AM
So was that the whole book, or was there stuff that was left out?
The book, as published, was revised to have it fit into the Original series continuity. So if there were any mentions of the Network, Iola being blown up or other Casefile plot points in the story, those would've been removed. Plus the level of violence would've been toned down.
They never mentioned any friends but Phil and Tony. Was Mr Pizza a Casefile hangout or not?
Mr. Pizza is definitely a hangout that originated in the Casefiles. But The Hardy Boys Digests have sometimes mentioned it too, I do believe, in the some of the later books. For that matter, an original Casefiles character, Liz Webling, has shown up in the Digests at least once too, I think.
Unless they just left it. I've never seen it in the digests until that book.
It's been a while, but I think "Mr. Pizza" did appear in the Digests in the early-90's. I think S&S was trying to give Tony a more reasonable after school job than driving truck for his Dad's construction business, as he did in the G&D books. Think about it, how many construction jobs do you see getting done on weekends or after 4 p.m. on weekday nights? Unless there's a time crunch, not many.
Quote from: tomswift2002 on February 08, 2017, 09:55:42 PM
It's been a while, but I think "Mr. Pizza" did appear in the Digests in the early-90's. I think S&S was trying to give Tony a more reasonable after school job than driving truck for his Dad's construction business, as he did in the G&D books. Think about it, how many construction jobs do you see getting done on weekends or after 4 p.m. on weekday nights? Unless there's a time crunch, not many.
From what I've read, the Hardy Boys Casefiles almost are like another world...not carried on from any other series.
The Casefiles took the established Hardy Boys universe....and blew it up- literally. ;)
Quote from: MacGyver on February 10, 2017, 06:55:38 AM
The Casefiles took the established Hardy Boys universe....and blew it up- literally. ;)
Something that I'm very happy about. :) Wish they would redo it for today's audience.
The Casefiles I see as splitting off after "The Swamp Monster". While I was re-reading "Dead On Target" recently I noticed that the boys were described as having experience, and at the end of the book, Joe asks Frank if he thinks that they will keep up their usual mysteries, or if they are now hi-tech terrorism/espionage fighters.
Quote from: tomswift2002 on February 10, 2017, 05:31:51 PM
The Casefiles I see as splitting off after "The Swamp Monster". While I was re-reading "Dead On Target" recently I noticed that the boys were described as having experience, and at the end of the book, Joe asks Frank if he thinks that they will keep up their usual mysteries, or if they are now hi-tech terrorism/espionage fighters.
How was
The Swamp Monster the starting point?
The Swamp Monster was the last 20 chapter book in The Hardy Boys originals/digests, if I recall correctly and thus, the last one with a longer amount of pages. Revenge of the Desert Phantom is also said to be a "test" Casefile, I believe- interestingly enough, that book details an account of The Hardy Boys acquiring a van (though different in detail as to the origin of the van in the Casefiles). I could see that as a starting off point.
Quote from: MacGyver on February 23, 2017, 09:55:18 AM
The Swamp Monster was the last 20 chapter book in The Hardy Boys originals/digests, if I recall correctly and thus, the last one with a longer amount of pages. Revenge of the Desert Phantom is also said to be a "test" Casefile, I believe- interestingly enough, that book details an account of The Hardy Boys acquiring a van (though different in detail as to the origin of the van in the Casefiles). I could see that as a starting off point.
So could
Revenge of the Desert Phantom be considered an official Casefile or is/was it not in the right Hardy Boys universe?
I consider it one of the Digests, but some other fans might consider it like an unofficial Casefiles book.
Quote from: Katie on February 23, 2017, 07:09:51 PM
So could Revenge of the Desert Phantom be considered an official Casefile or is/was it not in the right Hardy Boys universe?
You have to remember that both Desrt Phantom and Skyfire were meant to take the Original series in a new direction. It even got to the point where there was, and the manuscript exists at S&S somewhere, of a #86 that would've continued on from Skyfire. However business decisions were made to where Desert Phantom and Skyfire, while not really fitting into either universe, were the only two published books in that direction.
But, there are a couple of things that make them hard to correlate with the Casefiles: 1. Chief Collig gives them a fully equipped police van in Phantom, whereas "Cult Of Crime" says the Casefiles van was from the Bayport Mall Association and that the boys customized it and installed the gear themselves. 2. "The Skyfire Puzzle" is a sequel to "Sky Sabotage". 3. "Dead On Target" makes it clear that that was he boys first time dealing with terrorism at the Assassins level.
Quote from: tomswift2002 on February 23, 2017, 09:32:37 PM
You have to remember that both Desert Phantom and Skyfire were meant to take the Original series in a new direction. It even got to the point where there was, and the manuscript exists at S&S somewhere, of a #86 that would've continued on from Skyfire. However business decisions were made to where Desert Phantom and Skyfire, while not really fitting into either universe, were the only two published books in that direction.
But, there are a couple of things that make them hard to correlate with the Casefiles: 1. Chief Collig gives them a fully equipped police van in Phantom, whereas "Cult Of Crime" says the Casefiles van was from the Bayport Mall Association and that the boys customized it and installed the gear themselves. 2. "The Skyfire Puzzle" is a sequel to "Sky Sabotage". 3. "Dead On Target" makes it clear that that was he boys first time dealing with terrorism at the Assassins level.
Yeah, don't the terrorism in the Casefiles seem like what government officials are dealing with today? Thinking of ISIS here.
Yes, it kind of does. (Though terrorism has been going on long before The Hardy Boys Casefiles books were written, unfortunately.) That's possibly one reason it's been avoided as a topic in current Hardy Boys books- mainly, it doesn't quite fit the scope of the Adventures books and maybe it hits too close to home right now.
Quote from: MacGyver on February 27, 2017, 07:05:38 AM
Yes, it kind of does. (Though terrorism has been going on long before The Hardy Boys Casefiles books were written, unfortunately.) That's possibly one reason it's been avoided as a topic in current Hardy Boys books- mainly, it doesn't quite fit the scope of the Adventures books and maybe it hits too close to home right now.
Yeah, but the thing with Russia is still going on. That never changed. It's too bad they can't redo, and they wouldn't even have to use real life events.
Hmm- well, I do believe Russian relations did change with the fall of the USSR. It wasn't quite like this when Mikhail Gorbachev and Boris Yeltsin were still in power- I think things have more recently built up to what they are now. But yes, it might be nice to see a revival of the series, but I tend to be wary of such revivals nowadays. I'd rather just read all 127 original books again.
Quote from: MacGyver on March 06, 2017, 09:41:49 PM
Hmm- well, I do believe Russian relations did change with the fall of the USSR. It wasn't quite like this when Mikhail Gorbachev and Boris Yeltsin were still in power- I think things have more recently built up to what they are now. But yes, it might be nice to see a revival of the series, but I tend to be wary of such revivals nowadays. I'd rather just read all 127 original books again.
Well I think the Big Lie series is going to be as close to Casefile as we can get.
That's probably true- so at least there's that. You can enjoy some Casefiles-like action there at least. :)
It sounds like there's more to The Big Lie then we know. Can't wait to find out what.
I just read the Mystery of the Silver Star and it seems like a pre-Casefile. Can anyone confirm this?
Quote from: Katie on February 24, 2020, 01:52:32 PM
I just read the Mystery of the Silver Star and it seems like a pre-Casefile. Can anyone confirm this?
Mystery of the Silver Star was the second #86 written. It was written after the Casefiles had been launched and S&S was restarting the Mystery Stories.
That said, S&S was trying to make them faster versions of #'s 1-83, and in my recent re-read of the Mystery Stories, a lot of the G&D books have been at or just below the Casefiles in terms of violence and action.
Quote from: tomswift2002 on February 24, 2020, 02:59:29 PM
Mystery of the Silver Star was the second #86 written. It was written after the Casefiles had been launched and S&S was restarting the Mystery Stories.
That said, S&S was trying to make them faster versions of #'s 1-83, and in my recent re-read of the Mystery Stories, a lot of the G&D books have been at or just below the Casefiles in terms of violence and action.
The second #86? There's another one?
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Quote from: Katie on February 24, 2020, 07:27:33 PM
The second #86? There's another one?
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There was an 86 written in the same style as #'s84 & 85, however, when the series took 1986 off, business decisions were made that led to the Casefiles being launched and the Mystery Stories being relaunched in a format similar in style to #'s 1-83. However in 1985, when the it was still being considered to send the Mystery Stories in the more Young Adult direction, a third book was written. An ISBN was even given to the book, however, no title was announced and the book was put into storage while
Mystery of the Silver Star was written as the first relaunch title.
Do you know if this abandoned title was incorporated elsewhere, perhaps as a Casefile?
No. It was buried in Simon & Schuster's warehouse somewhere, and has never seen the light of day. Back in the late-90's S&S editor of the Hardy Boys at the time, Anne Greenberg, even confirmed that it existed to I think James Keeline, but she didn't have time to pull it out and show him and then in the early-2000's she was let go in a corporate shuffling and no longer had access to it.
Okay. Thanks for the information. Too bad this book never saw the light of day in some form or another.
Quote from: tomswift2002 on February 24, 2020, 02:59:29 PM
Mystery of the Silver Star was the second #86 written. It was written after the Casefiles had been launched and S&S was restarting the Mystery Stories.
That said, S&S was trying to make them faster versions of #%u2019s 1-83, and in my recent re-read of the Mystery Stories, a lot of the G&D books have been at or just below the Casefiles in terms of violence and action.
What digests would you say are close to the Casefiles?
#84 Revenge of the Desert Phantom
#85 The Skyfire Puzzle
(These were the Pilot books for what ultimately became the Casefiles).
#150 The Crisscross Crime (this was actually commissioned as Casefiles #130)
As for closest to a Casefile that are unknown:
#161 Training For Trouble
#153 Eye On Crime
But, really as I've been going through the Hardy Boys Mystery Stories I've found that the revised texts of 1-38, and then 39-66 are just as violent as the Casefiles, although the action is not as quick as the Casefiles, because the books are 20 chapters vs the Casefiles range of 14-18 chapters.